There are numerous theories about Malinalli’s death; among them, that she was murdered. Why did you choose this end for Malinalli? Why bring Malinalli to Tepeyac Hill?
Because Tepeyac is where Tonantzin, the quintessential mother figure, is worshipped. And because in that same spot, on the twelfth day of the twelfth month, twelve years after Cortés’s arrival, the Virgin of Guadalupe, the symbol of cultural and religious syncretism, would appear. I put Malinche there just hours before her death, entrusting her children to Tonantzin, on a twelfth day, the same day that Malinalli was born, as a way of closing, with her, a female cycle of regeneration and life.
What does malinche mean in the Náhuatl language? Explain the significance of this word. How strong is the resonance of the word malinche today in Mexico? When is it used and by whom?
Malinche is the name the indigenous people gave to Cortés, because it was similar to Malinalli, which was Malinche’s real name. I don’t know exactly at what point Malinalli became Malinche and Cortés was no longer called Malinche. Malinalli is a plant, a twisted climbing vine that was used for building houses, but it was also an astrological sign. Today, malinche is used pejoratively to describe someone who denies their heritage, someone who values other cultures above their own.
Malinche is considered by some to be a traitor. What is your opinion of her?
Historical facts cannot be judged from a modern perspective. When Cortés arrived in the New World, Mexico as we know it did not exist. There was an empire that had imposed itself by force and from which everyone wanted to escape. Malinche was a slave who before being given to Cortés had already been given away twice before. She had no obligation to be loyal to an empire that had subjugated everyone, with no respect for their rights. But that was not the most important thing; what is most relevant is the way in which she carried out her job as the “tongue,” as the mediator between two worlds, between two visions.
What did Malinalli give to you, as a writer? What did you learn from interpreting history through the eyes of this native woman?
It was a pleasant experience, because the indigenous peoples have a wonderful vision of the cosmos, of the Earth, and of nature’s forces. If only we could recover that sacred connection with the world that surrounds us. For our ancestors, every daily task had a meaning that went far beyond simple personal satisfaction. They knew that everything has an effect on everything else. There is nothing that we say, think, or do that goes unnoticed. And now, thanks to the latest discoveries in quantum physics, we know what this means. In these absurdly materialistic times, awakening our cosmic awareness would be a real alternative.
Malinalli went from being a slave to becoming the most powerful woman in the conquest. Where does this ambition, if you can call it that, come from in her?
Malinche was driven by a desire for freedom, something very different from the ambition that motivated Cortés. Someone given as a slave three times, who had to “conquer” her masters in order to be treated well, must have nurtured inside herself the desire to be someone special. To be treated better. To be appreciated. When Cortés offers her freedom in exchange for her work as a translator, that automatically gives her power. The power to translate. The power of the word. The power to control information.
Malinalli gave rise to the Mexican people by giving birth to a half-indigenous and half-Spanish son. What does it mean that Malinalli, thanks to the double meaning of the word, wraps him up twice, both with her body and with the cloth woven of malinalli?
The Aztec hieroglyph that represents the twelfth day—the day that marks Malinche’s destiny—has a skull in profile. Instead of hair, the skull has malinalli, the fiber also known as coalman’s grass. It is the symbol of that which dies and is transformed. It also alludes to a new people, snatched from the jaws of death by their mother, who wrapped them in malinalli in order to make them whole again, with new life. Malinche wrapping up her son with her own body has all of these meanings.
Let’s talk a little bit about the separate spheres within the novel; there is the sphere ruled by the Náhuatl and the one the Spaniards dominate, so there is an indigenous realm and a European one, neither of which has room for those of mixed race.
Throughout the conquest and for many years following it, the indigenous world was devalued, the European overvalued and the mestizo, or mixed race, had a conflicted, divided identity. Reconsidering the conquest allows one to see the indigenous world in a different way and, of course, the mestizo world as well. This new position shifts the idealized European world into a more realistic light and allows people of mixed race to see themselves in a more comfortable way, and even proudly.
Tell us about the cult of the Virgin of Guadalupe and the pyramid of Tonantzin. What significance do they have today in your country?
The cult of the Virgin of Guadalupe is the most important in my country. Each year, her shrine is visited by millions of pilgrims, and the holiday devoted to celebrating her includes pagan rituals dedicated to Tonantzin. One could say that before we were Mexicans, we were Guadalupans. The Virgin of Guadalupe was the most important cohesive factor, second only to the conquest. The image of the virgin came to us from Europe but it contains a series of absolutely clear syncretic indigenous elements, which blend two cosmologies into one. This attempt at cultural and spiritual reconciliation is one of the most important elements of the unifying spirit of the Mexican people: our mixed heritage. All of us mestizos are survivors of the conquest and we all must accommodate two, or more, cultures in order to exist.
Malinalli had left texts or documents such as codices, what would they have said?
That is exactly the question I asked myself, and the answer lies in the codex that accompanies this book. In it, I tried to capture the images that Malinche would have painted to tell her story. Jordi Castells created the codex, and in order to do so he had to carry out an intense period of research on pre-Hispanic codices. The result is excellent.
Laura Esquivel, Malinche
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